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General Category => Anime / Manga => Topic started by: zeldafan42 on 18 July, 2008, 11:32:49 pm



Title: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: zeldafan42 on 18 July, 2008, 11:32:49 pm
Everywhere I go on the Internet, I see people bashing anime, and claiming it sucks. Well, I for one am sick and tired of this ignorant use of the term "anime".

The word anime can be used to describe pretty much any piece of Japanese animation. So when people use the phrase "anime sucks", they're making a gross generalization that personally makes me very upset.

So, I decided to do something about it. I decided it was time to unite the anime fans of the world. It's time we start a movement to stop people from misusing the word "anime" like this.

Yes we realize some anime sucks. But not all of it sucks. And in fact, some of it is so good that it gets awards and recognized by various organizations. In fact, one piece of Japanese animation in particular, a certain anime movie, was of such high quality, it won an Oscar.

I'm talking about Spirited Away.

I have recently constructed what I call the "Spirited Away defense".

When people use the phrase "All anime sucks" or some variation of it, what you do is post and debunk their claim by explaining "Anime is a very broad term that can be used to describe any form of Japanese animation. In 2002, the animated Japanese movie Spirited Away won the Oscar for "Best Animated Feature". This is especially notable because it beat out four other movies to win this Oscar. Now, obviously, the fact that it won an Oscar over four other movies goes to prove that a large group of people found Spirited Away to be of high quality. And by large group of people, I mean "a large group of people who aren't necessarily anime fans, and I bet many of them don't even know what anime is". So obviously, Spirited Away is a good movie. But, by the broad definition of anime, Spirited Away is an anime. So if you say all anime sucks, you're also ignorantly criticizing a great, Oscar winning movie."

Of course, the defense doesn't have to be an exact copy of my version. That's just a guideline to guide your own attempts at the "Spirited Away Defense".



Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: ganonfloyd on 18 July, 2008, 11:38:14 pm
Spirited Away was awesome.

Akira was better, I thought.

so I won't say that all anime sucks, I'll say that the majoirty of anime I've seen did not entertain me, with a few exceptions (including the above two)


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Ahriman on 18 July, 2008, 11:40:06 pm
To be fair, it didn't really have much competition in it's category. I don't believe any Pixar movies had come out that year. Either way, Spirited away was a fantastic movie.

And you could use and Miyazaki film for this, really. Hell, Princess Mononoke was the second highest grossing film during the 20th century. (the first being Titanic) And one thing you're forgetting; the people that prance about saying anime sucks aren't smart enough to comprehend any valid argument.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: zeldafan42 on 18 July, 2008, 11:48:08 pm
*nods head*

There are some great series out there besides anime movies.

One Piece (the original Japanese version, not the 4Kids version or the censored Funimation version.) is a great series. Even from an unbiased literary standpoint, it's eons ahead of Naruto and Bleach in quality. The story and its characters are just plain out good.

Now, in all honesty, shounen anime are a genre with a pre-packaged fanbase. If you like one shounen anime, chances are, you'll like a lot of the other series.

But if you look beyond that to some of the more complex animes, you get some good series.

For example, Ranma 1/2. One part martial arts shounen series, one part harem romance series, one part gender bender comedy series, with just a couple hints of shoujo style romance mixed in. It's a great series that doesn't feel as a generic as alot of other shounen anime.

To be fair, it didn't really have much competition in it's category. I don't believe any Pixar movies had come out that year. Either way, Spirited away was a fantastic movie.

And you could use and Miyazaki film for this, really. Hell, Princess Mononoke was the second highest grossing film during the 20th century. (the first being Titanic) And one thing you're forgetting; the people that prance about saying anime sucks aren't smart enough to comprehend any valid argument.

Well, you have to realize...it's the people who ignorantly make the topics that aren't smart enough to comprehend any valid argument. There are still some other, more intelligent people that, whether because of peer pressure or some other reason, will blindly follow pre-conceived notions and mindlessly say anime sucks, yet when presented with an intelligent argument, you may just change their mind.

It's for people like that, the ones smart enough to get what I'm saying that I made the "Spirited Away defense" for.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Dusty Starr on 19 July, 2008, 09:36:35 pm
I agree with everything you just said Michal, I just can't think of any way to comment on it.

Thank you for your "Spirited Away Defense".


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: T-1000 on 19 July, 2008, 09:40:12 pm
I think people say that anime sucks is because of the difference in cultures.Shoot watching some anime made me think all Japanese people are perverted. All Isay was young girls with boobs and slutty clothing. Lil boys that got their ass wooped by older men. Girls getting their ass wooped by older men. But some are not bad and not only aobut "fan sevice". Although you dont have many anime to support your "spirited away" defense.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: zeldafan42 on 19 July, 2008, 10:15:23 pm
Actually, if I felt like it, I could compile a decent sized list of animes that are of a much higher quality than the typical shounen anime.

I just use Spirited Away as a main point because it won an Oscar. Which is a pretty big deal.

But like Ahriman said, you can pretty much use any Miyazaki film.
Spirited Away, Princess Mononoke, Howl's Moving Castle, Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind...the list goes on.

As for high quality anime series...Ranma 1/2...JoJo's Bizarre Adventure....Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann (generally considered one of the best animes made in recent years)....One Piece (the original Japanese version ).....I could come up with more, but I think you get the point.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Dusty Starr on 19 July, 2008, 10:23:49 pm
Cowboy Bebop was voted one of the best Animes out there.  If there is a list, that should be on it.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: zeldafan42 on 19 July, 2008, 11:13:52 pm
Cowboy Bebop was voted one of the best Animes out there.  If there is a list, that should be on it.

Ah, yes, sorry. Forgot about that one. Cowboy Bebop was great too.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Maniac234678 on 20 July, 2008, 02:01:20 am
I'd like to say I agree, but every post of yours is riddled with fangirlism, bias, and the use of general conception. Still, I agree with the general concept.

And I'm going to say that anime is hated in the same vein Halo, Call of Duty and GTA are hated; it's insanely popular.

EDIT: Worse example: people calling others "weeaboos" (dont paddl me plz) because they mentioned something that has anything to do with anime. It both makes me laugh and depresses me when some idiot calls me a weeaboo; me.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Z911 on 20 July, 2008, 02:07:54 am
It both makes me laugh and depresses me when some idiot calls me a weeaboo; me.
Weeaboo.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Dusty Starr on 22 July, 2008, 02:33:45 am
Um, what is a weeaboo?


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Marie Rose on 22 July, 2008, 01:55:39 pm
Um, what is a weeaboo?
Someone who likes things from japanese culture a bit too much, like using stupid words such as "Kawaii" in a english sentence.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: I_like_Nonon on 22 July, 2008, 05:29:46 pm
Um, what is a weeaboo?
Someone who likes things from japanese culture a bit too much, like using stupid words such as "Kawaii" in a english sentence.
^this is the extreme version. Using Kawaii in a sentence doesn't make a weeaboo, though some people think it does.

It's the same as calling someone a nazi if they use a german word in a sentence.


And I'm basically fed up with people saying anime is for children, "becuz iz a cartoonz. Lulz u watch cartoonz nub u shud wach moviz with gunz and rap and bloodz lololol that iz adult olo"

I can point to MILLIONS of anime series not for kids.

Elfen lied
One piece
Naruto
BLeach
Tengen toppa gurren lagann
Love hina
Mahou sensei negima
FMA
Blood+
Fairy tail
The .hack series
Cowboy bepop
Shakugan no shana
Excel saga
puni puni poemi
Mahou shoujo lyrical nanoha


ANd tons and tons of anime are NOT for children. They deal with death, there's blood, tehre's ecchi, there are serious issues like abandonment, insanity, mortality, and so many other mature themes.


Saying anime is for kids, is like saying "Batman begins" is for 3-5 year olds. Retarded, unnecessary, and completely assidiotic.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Ahriman on 22 July, 2008, 08:33:29 pm
Um, what is a weeaboo?
Someone who likes things from japanese culture a bit too much, like using stupid words such as "Kawaii" in a english sentence.
^this is the extreme version. Using Kawaii in a sentence doesn't make a weeaboo, though some people think it does.

It's the same as calling someone a nazi if they use a german word in a sentence.


And I'm basically fed up with people saying anime is for children, "becuz iz a cartoonz. Lulz u watch cartoonz nub u shud wach moviz with gunz and rap and bloodz lololol that iz adult olo"

I can point to MILLIONS of anime series not for kids.

Elfen lied
One piece
Naruto
BLeach
Tengen toppa gurren lagann
Love hina
Mahou sensei negima
FMA
Blood+
Fairy tail
The .hack series
Cowboy bepop
Shakugan no shana
Excel saga
puni puni poemi
Mahou shoujo lyrical nanoha


ANd tons and tons of anime are NOT for children. They deal with death, there's blood, tehre's ecchi, there are serious issues like abandonment, insanity, mortality, and so many other mature themes.


Saying anime is for kids, is like saying "Batman begins" is for 3-5 year olds. Retarded, unnecessary, and completely assidiotic.

Oh geez, where do I begin with this post?

Firstly, a weeaboo is, as SA2 posted, somebody that obsesses over Japan. And they do have a tendency to use Japanese words in otherwise english sentences that are totally pointless and out of place. Now, I ask, why would you use the word kawaii in place of an english word if you were not a weeaboo? That's doesn't seem to make much sense to me.

But more importantly, the second part of your post. I'm not going to go through each one individually, but most of what you posted are shonen, which means, well, the target audience is boys, as opposed to men. That's not to say anime is for kids, though, that's like saying TV is for kids because there are kid's shows on it.

And sorry if I sound like I'm being mean, I'm really not trying to be. The main thing is it bugged me that you said Naruto isn't made for kids. <_<


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: I_like_Nonon on 23 July, 2008, 06:58:21 am
Um, what is a weeaboo?
Someone who likes things from japanese culture a bit too much, like using stupid words such as "Kawaii" in a english sentence.
^this is the extreme version. Using Kawaii in a sentence doesn't make a weeaboo, though some people think it does.

It's the same as calling someone a nazi if they use a german word in a sentence.


And I'm basically fed up with people saying anime is for children, "becuz iz a cartoonz. Lulz u watch cartoonz nub u shud wach moviz with gunz and rap and bloodz lololol that iz adult olo"

I can point to MILLIONS of anime series not for kids.

Elfen lied
One piece
Naruto
BLeach
Tengen toppa gurren lagann
Love hina
Mahou sensei negima
FMA
Blood+
Fairy tail
The .hack series
Cowboy bepop
Shakugan no shana
Excel saga
puni puni poemi
Mahou shoujo lyrical nanoha


ANd tons and tons of anime are NOT for children. They deal with death, there's blood, tehre's ecchi, there are serious issues like abandonment, insanity, mortality, and so many other mature themes.


Saying anime is for kids, is like saying "Batman begins" is for 3-5 year olds. Retarded, unnecessary, and completely assidiotic.

Oh geez, where do I begin with this post?

Firstly, a weeaboo is, as SA2 posted, somebody that obsesses over Japan. And they do have a tendency to use Japanese words in otherwise english sentences that are totally pointless and out of place. Now, I ask, why would you use the word kawaii in place of an english word if you were not a weeaboo? That's doesn't seem to make much sense to me.
We completely disagree on this then. If you japanese culture references, japanese history references, japanese city references, and more than 3 japanese words in a sentence, then you're obviously obsessed with Japan.

Using a SINGLE japanese word in a sentence does not make you obsessed with Japan. It means you think the word is cool/awesome/cute/win/whatever. IT doesn't mean the country is awesome.

Same as you, I'm not trying to be mean. THe following might SOUND mean, but please understand that I'm not intentionally trying to be.

Lets use your logic then. The word computer. Everyone in denmark uses it. Everyone in sweden uses it. Everyone in norway uses it, hell I bet a lot of countries use it. Does that mean everyone is obsessed with America, or any other english speaking country?

No. Ergo, flawed logic.

But more importantly, the second part of your post. I'm not going to go through each one individually, but most of what you posted are shonen, which means, well, the target audience is boys, as opposed to men. That's not to say anime is for kids, though, that's like saying TV is for kids because there are kid's shows on it.

And sorry if I sound like I'm being mean, I'm really not trying to be. The main thing is it bugged me that you said Naruto isn't made for kids. <_<
We're talking standards here.

In japan, 70% of anime is made for teens, or kids, that parts true. However, because the japanese have a different culture, they're used to things like blood, death and borderline **** on the T.V.

Just as an example, american kids aren't. Because their parents have the flawed logic that "If the kids see blood, they will become serial killers and murder over 1000000000 people."

Anime is for japanese kids. If just parents in the western world weren't so god damn sensitive, I can agree to some point that anime would indeed be for kids.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Marie Rose on 24 July, 2008, 05:15:20 am
>_>
<_<

"Silly rabbit, Trix are for kids!"


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Rai on 24 July, 2008, 09:41:13 am
Most anime isn't very good.

Just like most cartoons, most TV in general, most music, most manga, most books of any kind, and most movies most media also aren't isn't very good.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: I_like_Nonon on 24 July, 2008, 11:50:49 am
But some anime excels at everything, and are so awesome and epic that they become instant classics (I.E Tengen toppa Gurren lagann)


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Spring-Loaded on 24 July, 2008, 03:18:57 pm
Sweeping generalizations such as "all _____ sucks" get no attention from me at all. I can't think of any category/classification/etc. that can be put in that blank and make the statement as a whole sound reasonable.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Ahriman on 25 July, 2008, 10:31:50 pm
Um, what is a weeaboo?
Someone who likes things from japanese culture a bit too much, like using stupid words such as "Kawaii" in a english sentence.
^this is the extreme version. Using Kawaii in a sentence doesn't make a weeaboo, though some people think it does.

It's the same as calling someone a nazi if they use a german word in a sentence.


And I'm basically fed up with people saying anime is for children, "becuz iz a cartoonz. Lulz u watch cartoonz nub u shud wach moviz with gunz and rap and bloodz lololol that iz adult olo"

I can point to MILLIONS of anime series not for kids.

Elfen lied
One piece
Naruto
BLeach
Tengen toppa gurren lagann
Love hina
Mahou sensei negima
FMA
Blood+
Fairy tail
The .hack series
Cowboy bepop
Shakugan no shana
Excel saga
puni puni poemi
Mahou shoujo lyrical nanoha


ANd tons and tons of anime are NOT for children. They deal with death, there's blood, tehre's ecchi, there are serious issues like abandonment, insanity, mortality, and so many other mature themes.


Saying anime is for kids, is like saying "Batman begins" is for 3-5 year olds. Retarded, unnecessary, and completely assidiotic.

Oh geez, where do I begin with this post?

Firstly, a weeaboo is, as SA2 posted, somebody that obsesses over Japan. And they do have a tendency to use Japanese words in otherwise english sentences that are totally pointless and out of place. Now, I ask, why would you use the word kawaii in place of an english word if you were not a weeaboo? That's doesn't seem to make much sense to me.
We completely disagree on this then. If you japanese culture references, japanese history references, japanese city references, and more than 3 japanese words in a sentence, then you're obviously obsessed with Japan.

Using a SINGLE japanese word in a sentence does not make you obsessed with Japan. It means you think the word is cool/awesome/cute/win/whatever. IT doesn't mean the country is awesome.

Same as you, I'm not trying to be mean. THe following might SOUND mean, but please understand that I'm not intentionally trying to be.

Lets use your logic then. The word computer. Everyone in denmark uses it. Everyone in sweden uses it. Everyone in norway uses it, hell I bet a lot of countries use it. Does that mean everyone is obsessed with America, or any other english speaking country?

No. Ergo, flawed logic.

But more importantly, the second part of your post. I'm not going to go through each one individually, but most of what you posted are shonen, which means, well, the target audience is boys, as opposed to men. That's not to say anime is for kids, though, that's like saying TV is for kids because there are kid's shows on it.

And sorry if I sound like I'm being mean, I'm really not trying to be. The main thing is it bugged me that you said Naruto isn't made for kids. <_<
We're talking standards here.

In japan, 70% of anime is made for teens, or kids, that parts true. However, because the japanese have a different culture, they're used to things like blood, death and borderline **** on the T.V.

Just as an example, american kids aren't. Because their parents have the flawed logic that "If the kids see blood, they will become serial killers and murder over 1000000000 people."

Anime is for japanese kids. If just parents in the western world weren't so god damn sensitive, I can agree to some point that anime would indeed be for kids.

1. I can't really say, as I don't live in Denmark, Sweden, or Norway, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm going to assume the word has been more or less assimilated into common speech if so many people say it. This would be the same as using the word tsunami in English. It isn't an English word, but it's not abnormal to be using it. Kawaii, however, is not something used anyone I've ever met that...well, isn't a weeaboo.

2. Naruto is completely uncensored (I think >_>) in America and still has a rating of TVPG. Several of the other shows you listed have a TV14 rating, but my main point was against Naruto. I agree for the most part though.

Sweeping generalizations such as "all _____ sucks" get no attention from me at all. I can't think of any category/classification/etc. that can be put in that blank and make the statement as a whole sound reasonable.

All emo music sucks.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Rai on 25 July, 2008, 10:34:02 pm
No, it's not completely uncensored.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Ahriman on 25 July, 2008, 10:36:40 pm
No, it's not completely uncensored.

What's censored? Maybe some of the stuff Jiraiya says, but I don't know what else. <_<


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Rai on 25 July, 2008, 11:12:02 pm
Neither do I, I just know it isn't completely uncensored <_<


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: ganonfloyd on 25 July, 2008, 11:23:42 pm
All emo music sucks.

Rites of Spring and Sunny Day Real Estate kick ass. Other than that, the genre is garbage.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Spring-Loaded on 26 July, 2008, 12:03:56 am
All emo music sucks.

Rites of Spring and Sunny Day Real Estate kick ass. Other than that, the genre is garbage.

There are exceptions, therefore the "All emo music sucks" statement fails.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Ahriman on 26 July, 2008, 12:45:52 am
All emo music sucks.

Rites of Spring and Sunny Day Real Estate kick ass. Other than that, the genre is garbage.

There are exceptions, therefore the "All emo music sucks" statement fails.

Uh... All vacuums suck.

>__>


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Rai on 26 July, 2008, 01:05:24 am
My vacuum is broken, it can only do reverse now.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: I_like_Nonon on 26 July, 2008, 05:18:49 am
1. I can't really say, as I don't live in Denmark, Sweden, or Norway, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm going to assume the word has been more or less assimilated into common speech if so many people say it. This would be the same as using the word tsunami in English. It isn't an English word, but it's not abnormal to be using it. Kawaii, however, is not something used anyone I've ever met that...well, isn't a weeaboo.

2. Naruto is completely uncensored (I think >_>) in America and still has a rating of TVPG. Several of the other shows you listed have a TV14 rating, but my main point was against Naruto. I agree for the most part though.

1. It has, but it's the same thing. It's a word that isn't from ones own language. Okay, perhaps bad example... lets move back to my first example, with german. Was John F. Kennedy a nazi? He used german words in his speech. "Ich bien ein berliner" (Spelt rongg). He used the words Ich, bien and ein, words taht aren't integrated in english. If kawaii makes you a weeaboo, then Kennedy must have been a nazi times... three.

Again, not trying to be mean.. just using harsh examples <_<

2. Okay, Naruto isn't the most adult anime. But it's more serious than stuff like Captain planet, power rangers, Barney the damn dinosaur and other kid stuff.

And as to my knowledge, it isn't fully uncensored... they don't show most of the blood. You see a tiny trickle of blood, but in the original there was more blood.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Spring-Loaded on 26 July, 2008, 05:36:22 pm
My vacuum is broken, it can only do reverse now.

And there you go.


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Ahriman on 26 July, 2008, 09:14:08 pm
My vacuum is broken, it can only do reverse now.

And there you go.

However, a vacuum that can't suck can't do what it's made to do, and that sucks too.


HA


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Marie Rose on 27 July, 2008, 05:28:31 am
o snap


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: I_like_Nonon on 27 July, 2008, 05:54:17 am
My vacuum is broken, it can only do reverse now.

And there you go.

However, a vacuum that can't suck can't do what it's made to do, and that sucks too.


HA
Logic makes my brain asplode

*Brain asplode*


Title: Re: Are you tired of people saying anime sucks?
Post by: Spring-Loaded on 27 July, 2008, 12:27:40 pm
Sucking is relative.


Yes.